tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32931256.post4558380109701225719..comments2024-03-22T05:20:44.167-07:00Comments on The Disaffected Lib: George Monbiot Gives Michael Moore One Upside the Head.The Mound of Soundhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09023839743772372922noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32931256.post-14713169712876416612020-05-08T14:44:48.700-07:002020-05-08T14:44:48.700-07:00Rural, when I see Moore et al and Monbiot (Team Cl...Rural, when I see Moore et al and Monbiot (Team Climate Science) lashing out at each other it is deeply dispiriting. They're mutually undermining just when we are in need of their cooperation.<br /><br />I don't know why Moore/Gibbs did this but they haven't helped their cause or those they ridicule. That's inexcusable and causes me to doubt Moore's sincerity. Monbiot's foolishness about overpopulation being off limits is also disappointing as is his failure to consider the population question in the context of what is looming for those heavily populated regions. Wilful blindness, I suppose. The Disaffected Libhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13135599782685108764noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32931256.post-17444860843036282852020-05-08T12:23:22.448-07:002020-05-08T12:23:22.448-07:00Thank you for your fullsome response Mound, I wish...Thank you for your fullsome response Mound, I wish I could say that I am as informed as yourself on these issues but I do not think I could handle the real truth of where were headed, which is not to say that I am unaware of the dangers. Perhaps this is the problem with all of us in general, we know instinctively we are in deep shit but don't know what to do about it so try to ignore the problem. Us 'old' folks (sorry just me) have more time to contemplate these issues but I am so pleased to see a LOT of young folks becoming aware and seaking out about the problem, we must somehow give these largely ignored young environmentalists a bigger place at the table for it is they that will pay the price.....<br /><br />In these days of Twitsplace and Facecrap only short and not necessarily accurate missives get any attention, how thoughtful writer like yourself are those whose missives you highlight get ant attention is something that this non user of those platforms will never understand!<br /><br /><br />Ruralhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11814103548500393628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32931256.post-18761908803528965122020-05-08T10:44:13.558-07:002020-05-08T10:44:13.558-07:00Hi, Rural. It took me years to make sense of all t...Hi, Rural. It took me years to make sense of all these dire reports and science. Finally I was able to lump these myriad issues into three categories - carbon emissions (man-made and natural), overpopulation and over-consumption. Once they were sorted the solution seemed obvious. Accepting that any of them would end human civilization it was clear that there must be a common solution, something that didn't rob Peter to pay Paul. The solution to these problems is for humankind to return safely within the finite limits of the environment, the biosphere, Spaceship Earth. <br /><br />The worst excess consumers, that's us, have to slash consumption. We cannot continue to overburden the planet's resources. Nations that contribute the most to GHG emissions have to lead in decarbonizing their societies and their economies. Nations that have overpopulated must find ways to cut those numbers. It can be done in just one generation without resorting to wars and such. <br /><br />The solutions may be obvious but they're not on the table, anyone's table. The richest nations continue the pursuit of perpetual, exponential growth - GDP. <br /><br />While alternative, clean energy is showing great promise we're fast running out of time to eliminate fossil fuels. I expect if we had an extra century we would get there. We don't.<br /><br />Depopulating is also unlikely. India and China emerged from WWII with populations in the 300-million range. Now they both foresee a 1.5 billion future. Add Africa into the mix and you have a dangerously overpopulated world.<br /><br />It's been estimated that we had a maximum sustainable population of about 3.5 billion (1970). Today we're closing in on 8 billion. That soil degradation map shows how we did it. As our numbers have soared, the planet's ability to support them has gone down causing us to further degrade that carrying capacity by exhausting our aquifers and depleting soil carbon through intensive agriculture demanding ever more fertilizers, herbicides and pesticides.<br /><br />We had a chance for a survivable, crash landing but it seems we've decided to auger in.<br /><br />The Disaffected Libhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13135599782685108764noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32931256.post-19317913273868201772020-05-08T04:14:05.726-07:002020-05-08T04:14:05.726-07:00A very good synopsis of a complex situation Mound,...A very good synopsis of a complex situation Mound, it seems to me that nature will eventually sort out our population problem, witness the current situation, however such eventual solution may be a permanent one ....for all of us!Ruralhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11814103548500393628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32931256.post-57806297770916622932020-05-07T14:34:06.602-07:002020-05-07T14:34:06.602-07:00We'll never sort this out, Lorne, if we divide...We'll never sort this out, Lorne, if we divide into camps, each pursuing its pet cause, and yet we're witnessing that unfold right before our eyes.The Disaffected Libhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13135599782685108764noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32931256.post-7845525568146720692020-05-07T13:19:32.713-07:002020-05-07T13:19:32.713-07:00I wrote about this as well today, Mound, but your ...I wrote about this as well today, Mound, but your post is far more comprehensive than mine. When I was writing it I had a feeling that you would disagree with Monbiot's assertions about population, and I have to say I agree with your perspective on this.Lornehttps://politicsanditsdiscontents.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.com